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PostPosted: 12/03/09 6:50 am • # 1 
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A good start ~ but I believe the abortion amendment is up for vote today, too ~ and THAT is a much bigger hurdle ~ Sooz

Senate casts 1st votes to overhaul health care

In its first vote on health care overhaul, the Senate Thursday narrowly approved an amendment to safeguard coverage of mammograms and preventive screening tests for women under a revamped system.

The 61-39 vote on an amendment by Sen. Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., and Sen. Olympia Snowe, R-Maine, would allow the Health and Human Services secretary to require insurers to cover preventive health screenings free of charge.

Under special provisions agreed to prior to the tally, 60 votes were needed to pass the amendment. The margin underscored the fragility of the coalition Democrats are counting on to move forward on President Barack Obama's signature issue.

Though Democrats have 60 votes in the Senate, two Democratic senators voted against the amendment -- Sen. Russell Feingold of Wisconsin and Ben Nelson of Nebraska. It was saved by three Republicans voting in favor -- Snowe, Susan Collins of Maine and David Vitter of Louisiana.

Waiting in the wings is an amendment to restrict abortion funding, except in cases of rape, incest, or to save the life of the mother. Drafted by Nelson, an abortion opponent, it looms as perhaps the biggest challenge for the Democrats.

Thursday's vote comes in the wake of heated controversy over a government advisory panel's recent recommendation that routine mammograms aren't needed for women in their 40s. Although the advisers' recommendation was nonbinding, it prompted fears that the health care legislation would usher in an era of rationing.

The Mikulski-Snowe amendment would give the health and human services secretary authority to require health plans to cover additional preventive services for women. The Congressional Budget Office said the amendment would cost $940 million over a decade.

Mikulski said her amendment would guarantee that decisions are left to women and their doctors, not placed in the hands of government bureaucrats or medical statisticians. She accepted a modification to her amendment by Vitter that would specifically prevent the controversial recommendations on mammograms from restricting coverage of the test.

However, Republicans said that Mikulski's amendment still left too much discretion to the HHS secretary. A competing amendment by Sen. Lisa Murkowski, R-Alaska, would prevent the government from using the recommendations of outside advisers to deny coverage of preventive services, including mammograms and Pap tests.

http://www.salon.com/wires/ap/business/ ... e_overhaul



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 10:34 am • # 2 
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How could anyone who likes or loves or respects or even simply tolerates women vote "no" on this amendment? ~ Image ~ Sooz

Senate roll call: Vote on women's health ~ By The Associated Press - 2 hrs 37 mins ago

The 61-39 roll call Thursday by which the Senate adopted an amendment to safeguard coverage of mammograms and preventive screening tests for women under a revamped health care system.

A "yes" vote is a vote to adopt the amendment.

Voting yes were 56 Democrats, 3 Republicans and 2 independents.

Voting no were 2 Democrats and 37 Republicans.

ALABAMA = Sessions (R), No; Shelby (R), No.

ALASKA = Begich (D), Yes; Murkowski (R), No.

ARIZONA = Kyl (R), No; McCain (R), No.

ARKANSAS = Lincoln (D), Yes; Pryor (D), Yes.

CALIFORNIA = Boxer (D), Yes; Feinstein (D), Yes.

COLORADO = Bennet (D), Yes; Udall (D), Yes.

CONNECTICUT = Dodd (D), Yes; Lieberman (I), Yes.

DELAWARE = Carper (D), Yes; Kaufman (D), Yes.

FLORIDA = LeMieux (R), No; Nelson (D), Yes.

GEORGIA = Chambliss (R), No; Isakson (R), No.

HAWAII = Akaka (D), Yes; Inouye (D), Yes.

IDAHO = Crapo (R), No; Risch (R), No.

ILLINOIS = Burris (D), Yes; Durbin (D), Yes.

INDIANA = Bayh (D), Yes; Lugar (R), No.

IOWA = Grassley (R), No; Harkin (D), Yes.

KANSAS = Brownback (R), No; Roberts (R), No.

KENTUCKY = Bunning (R), No; McConnell (R), No.

LOUISIANA = Landrieu (D), Yes; Vitter (R), Yes.

MAINE = Collins (R), Yes; Snowe (R), Yes.

MARYLAND = Cardin (D), Yes; Mikulski (D), Yes.

MASSACHUSETTS = Kerry (D), Yes; Kirk (D), Yes.

MICHIGAN = Levin (D), Yes; Stabenow (D), Yes.

MINNESOTA = Franken (D), Yes; Klobuchar (D), Yes.

MISSISSIPPI = Cochran (R), No; Wicker (R), No.

MISSOURI = Bond (R), No; McCaskill (D), Yes.

MONTANA = Baucus (D), Yes; Tester (D), Yes.

NEBRASKA = Johanns (R), No; Nelson (D), No.

NEVADA = Ensign (R), No; Reid (D), Yes.

NEW HAMPSHIRE = Gregg (R), No; Shaheen (D), Yes.

NEW JERSEY = Lautenberg (D), Yes; Menendez (D), Yes.

NEW MEXICO = Bingaman (D), Yes; Udall (D), Yes.

NEW YORK = Gillibrand (D), Yes; Schumer (D), Yes.

NORTH CAROLINA = Burr (R), No; Hagan (D), Yes.

NORTH DAKOTA = Conrad (D), Yes; Dorgan (D), Yes.

OHIO = Brown (D), Yes; Voinovich (R), No.

OKLAHOMA = Coburn (R), No; Inhofe (R), No.

OREGON = Merkley (D), Yes; Wyden (D), Yes.

PENNSYLVANIA = Casey (D), Yes; Specter (D), Yes.

RHODE ISLAND = Reed (D), Yes; Whitehouse (D), Yes.

SOUTH CAROLINA = DeMint (R), No; Graham (R), No.

SOUTH DAKOTA = Johnson (D), Yes; Thune (R), No.

TENNESSEE = Alexander (R), No; Corker (R), No.

TEXAS = Cornyn (R), No; Hutchison (R), No.

UTAH = Bennett (R), No; Hatch (R), No.

VERMONT = Leahy (D), Yes; Sanders (I), Yes.

VIRGINIA = Warner (D), Yes; Webb (D), Yes.

WASHINGTON = Cantwell (D), Yes; Murray (D), Yes.

WEST VIRGINIA = Byrd (D), Yes; Rockefeller (D), Yes.

WISCONSIN = Feingold (D), No; Kohl (D), Yes.

WYOMING = Barrasso (R), No; Enzi (R), No.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_senate_ro ... n_s_health



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:02 pm • # 3 
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if you hate Obama more than you care about women, you vote no on this, i guess.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:21 pm • # 4 
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This is from Alternet, written by Daniela Perdomo. http://www.alternet.org/blogs/healthwel ... amendment/
Earlier today, the Senate passed an amendment to its health care bill that would ensure insurance companies provide women an extensive package of preventive services. The vote for the clause, introduced by Barbara Mikulski (D-MD), was 61-39.

The New York Times wrote that it passed "with three Republicans joining 56 Democrats and the two independents in favor" -- so the first thing I thought was, "If even two GOP senators voted for it, who the hell were the two Dems that nayed it?"

Considering his threat to introduce a "Stupak-like amendment," pro-lifer Ben Nelson (D-NE), was the first name that came to mind. And I was right. The second, however, was a little puzzling -- Russ Feingold (D-WI). According to OpenCongress, Nelson is one of the senators Feingold votes with least often.

It's not as easy for me to gloss over Feingold's votes as those of most of his colleagues, because he does strike as me as one of the more reasonable members of the Senate. After all, he was among the few that voted against the war in Iraq and the only one to vote against the PATRIOT Act, the legislative antonym of civil liberties.

Feingold's official statement is that his nay vote was cast as one for fiscal responsibility. The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that the amendment would cost $980 million over the next decade.

Where would that money be spent?

The amendment guarantees that all women will receive a free annual gynecological exam, which would include screenings for the leading killers of women -- breast, cervical, ovarian and lung cancers; heart disease; and chronic illnesses such as diabetes. It also requires insurance plans to cover a whole slew of comprehensive preventive care and screenings specific to women, with no copayments.

That is music to my ears. I suppose I take this amendment very personally because I was diagnosed with a very common but -- as it turns out -- very expensive pre-cancerous gynecological affliction this summer. I have insurance and do all the right things -- annual exam, preventive screenings, you name it. My mother raised a little hypochondriac. But despite doing "everything right," I was saddled with nearly $6,000 in copayments and coinsurance. And the bills keep coming in, months later.

I am lucky, of course -- my diagnosis was completely treatable, albeit outrageously pricey given the high rate of its incidence. But ever since, I've felt, as Mikulski so aptly phrased it, that "simply being a woman is treated as a pre-existing condition."

I can't rail against Feingold and say that he's shown little fiscal restraint when voting for other measures. He voted against the bailout giveaway to the banks, and he continues to make clear that if Obama wishes to earn his vote for funding Vietghanistan, it must come with a precise timetable for withdrawal.

In other words, I think Feingold's votes are often sound. But I do think he is wrong on this one, and I pick on him because he's normally so level-headed. (I won't even try to call out the other 38 nay-vote boneheads.)

Women bear the brunt of extremely complex reproductive systems that do require specialized health care. In our heinous profit-driven health care system, taking care of our female bodies is really expensive. But, as they say, what do we have if we don't have our health?

If there's anything worth driving our country further into debt for, it's the wellness of at least half our population.

Tagged as: senate, women's rights, russ feingold, health care reform, ben nelson, barbara mikulski

Daniela Perdomo is a contributing writer & editor at AlterNet. You



Last edited by grampatom on 12/03/09 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:27 pm • # 5 
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wow. that defys anything other than puzzled response from me.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:28 pm • # 6 
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I wonder what he would have done if the count before he voted had been 59-41.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:29 pm • # 7 
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grampatom wrote:
I wonder what he would have done if the count before he voted had been 59-41.


i assume you mean 59-40, and i have no idea.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 12:52 pm • # 8 
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Gramps, I am going to "edit" your post to UNstretch the page ~

Sooz



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 1:16 pm • # 9 
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Daniela Perdomo is 100% correct ~ look at what we've learned about the attitudes toward female health already this year ~ some insurance companies consider domestic violence a pre-existing condition ~ and if you've had a Caesarian section birth, pregnancy and maternity cover can be denied ~ it's mind-boggling ~ I generally respect principled politicians, especially when they are confronted with issues that challenge their personal principles ~ but I view health care reform as a moral imperative ~ and if these legislators can approve MEGA dollars for outdated military hardware, they can approve MEGA dollars to protect female [and male] health ~ I am angry with Feingold's vote ~ and with Nelson's, too, because this amendment does NOT impact his abortion amendment ~ and don't get me started on how I feel about ANY abortion amendment ~

Sooz



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 3:30 pm • # 10 
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i assume you mean 59-40, and i have no idea

Right on both points.

I meant to wonder what he would have done had his vote left the amendment 1 vote short of 60 votes.



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 3:51 pm • # 11 

A vote against an amendment doesn't necessarily mean someone is voting against the concept, but rather the specifics of the proposal. New spending should be accompanied by corresponding cuts in spending elsewhere, or increased revenue generation to prevent additional deficit spending.

Some of this has to be addressed pronto, because the net effect on the deficit over the next ten years provides a skewed picture of the long-term budgetary effects of the current healthcare reform proposals. Tax increases begin sooner than the bulk of the new spending, so over the first 10 years there may be a net projected reduction of the deficit over that time, but in the out years beyond that, the spending is going to outstrip the added revenue on a year-by-year basis and add to the deficit.



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PostPosted: 12/03/09 4:10 pm • # 12 
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macroscopic wrote:
if you hate Obama more than you care about women, you vote no on this, i guess.


I think that about sums it up.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 4:32 pm • # 13 
That's as ridiculous as saying, "If you vote against the Patriot Act, you hate America."


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 5:00 pm • # 14 
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"If you vote for the Patriot Act, you hate America."

There. Fixed it for you and now it's not ridiculous anymore.
Now back to the issue and why the reichwing hates women so much. Image


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 5:25 pm • # 15 
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gopqed wrote:
That's as ridiculous as saying, "If you vote against the Patriot Act, you hate America."

no it isn't. i never said anything about hating women in my reply. and incidentally, i feel completely justified in my position, since this amendment should have passed 99:1 under what i would consider to be NORMAL circumstances. if you don't, articulate WHY, rather than saying it is ridiculous, unless you would like similarly dismissive replies to YOUR posts in the future. Image


Last edited by macroscopic on 12/03/09 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 12/03/09 5:37 pm • # 16 
The amendment as written increases spending without being tied to corresponding spending reductions or revenue increases, and is not budget neutral. That's why it should have been defeated, or modified to be budget neutral.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 5:41 pm • # 17 
I had already explained that, by the way. I also stand by my other statement, as I wasn't saying that you said people hated women. I was pointing out the ridiculous nature of simplistic slams of positions on bills that put words in people's mouths without looking at their arguments on the bill in question.


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 7:02 pm • # 18 
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gopqed wrote:
The amendment as written increases spending without being tied to corresponding spending reductions or revenue increases, and is not budget neutral. That's why it should have been defeated, or modified to be budget neutral.

um......how does preventative care drive UP healthcare costs? what am i missing here, gop?


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PostPosted: 12/03/09 7:03 pm • # 19 
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gopqed wrote:
I had already explained that, by the way. I also stand by my other statement, as I wasn't saying that you said people hated women. I was pointing out the ridiculous nature of simplistic slams of positions on bills that put words in people's mouths without looking at their arguments on the bill in question.

and i was pointing out that in the absence of any RATIONAL explanation, there is probably a strategic one. please don't equate me with the MORONS on the left and right that sloganeer around with smug satisfaction. that is not how i kick it, bro.


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PostPosted: 12/04/09 3:04 am • # 20 
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gopqed wrote:
The amendment as written increases spending without being tied to corresponding spending reductions or revenue increases, and is not budget neutral. That's why it should have been defeated, or modified to be budget neutral.
Sorry ladies, it's just not "budget neutral" for us to avoid your death through preventative care.

Image


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PostPosted: 12/04/09 5:02 am • # 21 
And this is the perfect example of why we are NOT ready for a national healthcare plan. Congress still thinks they can legislate every procedure that should be allowed or disallowed under the plan rather than leaving it between the physicians and patients as to what is needed.

Frankly, why don't we just ditch all efforts to cover routine procedures that most people can afford on their own if they weren't shelling out mega-bucks to insurance companies, and just focus on MAJOR medical..the things insurance is SUPPOSED to cover...the unexpected and unanticipated and can happen at any time whether you have had time to save for it or not.


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PostPosted: 12/04/09 9:01 am • # 22 
macroscopic wrote:
gopqed wrote:
The amendment as written increases spending without being tied to corresponding spending reductions or revenue increases, and is not budget neutral. That's why it should have been defeated, or modified to be budget neutral.

um......how does preventative care drive UP healthcare costs? what am i missing here, gop?


I don't know all of the details of the Mikulski amendment, but the CBO estimated it will cost the federal government about $1 billion over the next 10 years.

The Republicans offered a competing amendment on the same subject, guaranteeing the same preventative services for women, which the CBO estimated would produce a net savings of something like $400 million over the same period. So the claim that the Republicans were opposing these guarantees is simply ill-informed.


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PostPosted: 12/04/09 9:06 am • # 23 
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It's my understanding the R "competing" amendment does NOT "guarantee[ing] the same preventative services" ~ I'll try to find a comparison of the two amendments ~

Sooz



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