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PostPosted: 12/07/11 4:55 am • # 1 
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Tennessee family home burns while firefighters watch

A Tennessee couple helplessly watched their home burn to the ground, along with all of their possessions, because they did not pay a $75 annual fee to the local fire department.

Vicky Bell told the NBC affiliate WPSD-TV that she called 911 when her mobile home in Obion County caught fire. Firefighters arrived on the scene but as the fire raged, they simply stood by and did nothing. "In an emergency, the first thing you think of, 'Call 9-1-1," homeowner Bell said. However, Bell and her husband were forced to walk into the burning home in an attempt to retrieve their own belongings. "You could look out my mom's trailer and see the trucks sitting at a distance," Bell said. "We just wished we could've gotten more out."

South Fulton Mayor David Crocker defended the fire department, saying that if firefighters responded to non-subscribers, no one would have an incentive to pay the fee. Residents in the city of South Fulton receive the service automatically, but it is not extended to those living in the greater county-wide area.

"There's no way to go to every fire and keep up the manpower, the equipment, and just the funding for the fire department," Crocker said.

The South Fulton policy produced precisely the same nightmare scenario last year, when homeowner Gene Cranick--who had likewise failed to pay the $75 annual fee for rural Obion County residents--saw his house engulfed by flames as South Fulton firefighter watched close by. That incident sparked a debate among conservative pundits over the limits of fee-for-service approaches to government.

For his part, Mayor Crocker stressed that the city's  firefighters will help people in danger, even those who haven't paid the fee. "After the last situation, I would hope that everybody would be well aware of the rural fire fees, this time," Crocker said.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/tennessee-family-home-burns-while-firefighters-watch-191241763.html


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 7:12 am • # 2 
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This is why firefighting coverage shouldn't be voluntary.  You'll always have people who will decide they won't pay until they need it.  She probably didn't pay for house insurance either and now she'll whine about being homeless and how it's somebody else's fault.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 7:43 am • # 3 
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I really hope you're being sarcastic, Jim.Image




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PostPosted: 12/07/11 7:58 am • # 4 
In the perfect world, firefighting services would be covered by way of municipal taxes. This incident (and others like it) is little more than the extortion sharks breaking their target's legs for non-payment.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 10:33 am • # 5 
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In rural areas, there is no municipality to provide fire fighters or garbage service for that matter. Everyone pays for them or suffers the consequences. I gladly paid my fire dues when I lived in the country. I was grateful that we had brave men and women who volunteered to provide that service and the dues paid for their equipment.

I don't know how much liability might come into play either. Suppose a firefighter gets injured or even disabled or killed? Perhaps their life insurance/health insurance or liability insurance won't cover them if they get hurt at a home who hasn't paid and aren't considered "members". I don't know.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 10:39 am • # 6 
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And I suggest that every dentist, doctor, animal vet (can't remember how to spell the whole word, lol.), and pharmacist be sure to deny service to any member of the voluteer fire department unless they can come up with the cash to pay for their services.

Couldn't they send the fire department send the family a bill for services rendered, rather than let the home burn down?  They could attach a warning that if the bill isn't paid within 60 days, the community can have a celebratory, festive wienie and marshmallow roast while the fire department pours kerosene on mobile home and sets it on fire.  You know, one of those "small town, old fashioned, communal celebrations of togetherness."

STOP!

I deleted a whole bunch of my ravings because they are meaningless. 

What kind of human beings are these people?   It's winter, it's getting cold in TN right about now.  How could they do this?  If they didn't go to the fire at all would be more acceptable than to actually go there with equipment that could have put the fire out and just watch.  How on earth could the "fireman" stand there, before those people of the community, and do nothing to save the home.  Why didn't they at least have the decency to drive away if they couldn't send the homeowners a bill.  But to actually stand there and watch! 


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 10:41 am • # 7 
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Any human being with a shred of decency doesn't stand around watching a disaster take place if in a position to help out.
It really isn't more complicated than thae.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 11:04 am • # 8 
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Jeannedeurk1 wrote:
And I suggest that every dentist, doctor, animal vet (can't remember how to spell the whole word, lol.), and pharmacist be sure to deny service to any member of the voluteer fire department unless they can come up with the cash to pay for their services.

Couldn't they send the fire department send the family a bill for services rendered, rather than let the home burn down?  They could attach a warning that if the bill isn't paid within 60 days, the community can have a celebratory, festive wienie and marshmallow roast while the fire department pours kerosene on mobile home and sets it on fire.  You know, one of those "small town, old fashioned, communal celebrations of togetherness."

STOP!

I deleted a whole bunch of my ravings because they are meaningless. 

What kind of human beings are these people?   It's winter, it's getting cold in TN right about now.  How could they do this?  If they didn't go to the fire at all would be more acceptable than to actually go there with equipment that could have put the fire out and just watch.  How on earth could the "fireman" stand there, before those people of the community, and do nothing to save the home.  Why didn't they at least have the decency to drive away if they couldn't send the homeowners a bill.  But to actually stand there and watch! 
I agree they could have sent a bill after the fact. I also agree that they should have not gone at all, rather than stand there and, for all intents and purposes, mock the homeowner. That is cruel and it seems as if they are just trying to make a point as the expense of this family.

oskar, I was just putting forth some "maybes" of why they didn't do their job, not defending them. Image 

  


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 11:29 am • # 9 
I heard the story as they go to fires in case a "paid for" property is put in danger by the fire they are letting burn.

I am not a fan of this fire subscription service.  


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 11:39 am • # 10 
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oskar, I was just putting forth some "maybes" of why they didn't do their job, not defending them.

I was reacting to the uncaring jackasses who call themsekves "voluntary firemen" in the OP.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 11:51 am • # 11 
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Couldn't they send the fire department send the family a bill for services rendered, rather than let the home burn down? 

If that were the case you would soon not have a fire department.  Why pay for something in advance if you can wait and see if you need it or not?  And who is going to pay for the myriad of other services the fire department provides besides putting out fires. 

And no, Chaos, I was not being sarcastic.  I meant it.  Sometimes you have to take responsibility for yourself and your family or suffer the consequences.  She couldn't be bothered to pay the $75 and now she's out of luck.  There's no indication in the story about it being a hardship or she didn't know about it or anything.  She just didn't bother paying.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 12:31 pm • # 12 
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oskar576 wrote:
Any human being with a shred of decency doesn't stand around watching a disaster take place if in a position to help out.
It really isn't more complicated than thae.
Well said, Oskar.

I'm glad most areas don't work this way, but I can't help thinking there are those that would see this as totally appropriate.

Imagine if your neighbor's house was burning and he says, "Quick, grab your garden hose!" and you respond with "First give me five bucks for the water".



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PostPosted: 12/07/11 12:38 pm • # 13 
Money wins.

Again.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 12:45 pm • # 14 
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jimwilliam wrote:
Couldn't they send the fire department send the family a bill for services rendered, rather than let the home burn down? 

If that were the case you would soon not have a fire department.  Why pay for something in advance if you can wait and see if you need it or not?  And who is going to pay for the myriad of other services the fire department provides besides putting out fires. 

And no, Chaos, I was not being sarcastic.  I meant it.  Sometimes you have to take responsibility for yourself and your family or suffer the consequences.  She couldn't be bothered to pay the $75 and now she's out of luck.  There's no indication in the story about it being a hardship or she didn't know about it or anything.  She just didn't bother paying.
I hadn't thought about it that way jim. Yes I guess they do need to make sure that people pay up in advance since they depend on those funds.    


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 12:57 pm • # 15 
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The word that comes to mind is venal.
Or maybe a new word would be more appropriate: Nerotic


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 1:19 pm • # 16 
A story from when I was about 12 years old, so about 1965.   I grew up in Sunbury, Pa.  Small town, working class, in the Center of the state; population approx 13K.   Volunteer fire companies and ambulance service.  In those days you paid the fire company $3 a year for ambulance card enabling you to service.

I was home one Saturday and my mother was away.   My dad came home and complained that he was bit by a bee while he was parking his truck at the end of the yard.   He went upstairs to check out his bite and go to the bathroom I guess.   No sooner did he get upstairs than I heard a thump.   He'd passed out.   I was freaked out and called whatever the equivalent of 911 was then and they said they'd send the ambulance.  

The ambulance guys arrived and went up and I think epi-penned him right then and there.  They asked me about the ambulance card, which I did not know.  They stated they'd take him and bill us, if he had a card all he'd have to do is show it.    I wasn't allowed to go in the ambulance to the hospital; age restrictions I think.  Days before cell phones so I couldn't get Mother.  I called my uncle who met dad at the hospital and later called me and said he was fine and he'd be bringing him home.  

My point, some services are too important to be choices.  You can't let someone lay on the bathroom floor because of an ambulance card (which he had BTW) or a house burn down because poor people are poor.   This subscription to fire service stuff would NEVER play in more affluent areas.   


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 1:37 pm • # 17 
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That fire department already has adequate funds to operate, or they wouldn't exist.

Residents in the city of South Fulton receive the service automatically, 

They only charge folks outside the city limits. They have the equipment, and the manpower. There's no reason to let a home burn just to "send a message". 



And to assume that a family in rural Tennessee, living in a TRAILER, has $75 laying around and is just too stupid to pay up is quite a nasty leap, Jim. 


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 2:30 pm • # 18 
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privatizing essential services is palpably absurd.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 6:21 pm • # 19 
Firefighting isn't essential. It's optional... don't you know????


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 7:05 pm • # 20 
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privatizing essential services is palpably absurd.

Bingo! 

I see this very much the same as the healthcare debate.  I know there are many who simply can't afford insurance and special consideration has to be given to them, but there are also many who exercise their "freedom" not to have to buy it.  Then, when they get sick they go charging into the hospital looking for service.  Sure, they may have to pay for it but a goodly part of the time they can't so the ones who do dutifully buy their insurance get the cost added onto their insurance premiums.


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 7:15 pm • # 21 
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And to assume that a family in rural Tennessee, living in a TRAILER, has $75 laying around and is just too stupid to pay up is quite a nasty leap, Jim.

Money wasn't the issue, Chaos.  She knew about the fee and for reasons of her own decided not to pay it.  She knew what she was doing and, to give her credit, she doesn't blame the fire department for not acrting.

http://www.nwtntoday.com/news.php?viewStory=64384


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PostPosted: 12/07/11 8:58 pm • # 22 
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jimwilliam wrote:
privatizing essential services is palpably absurd.

Bingo! 

I see this very much the same as the healthcare debate.  I know there are many who simply can't afford insurance and special consideration has to be given to them, but there are also many who exercise their "freedom" not to have to buy it.  Then, when they get sick they go charging into the hospital looking for service.  Sure, they may have to pay for it but a goodly part of the time they can't so the ones who do dutifully buy their insurance get the cost added onto their insurance premiums.
you know what is funny?  we are REQUIRED to have auto insurance in most (if not all) places in the US.  do people bitch and moan about the injustice and unconstitutionality of it?  no. 

how did we get this disconnected from not only everybody else's reality, but our own?


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PostPosted: 12/08/11 2:07 am • # 23 
"how did we get this disconnected from not only everybody else's reality, but our own?"

Could "reality TV" have anything to do with it? People are disconnected from each other despite having all the best communication tools in human history at their fingertips. We're disconnected from our food to the point where kids don't know that apples come from trees and carrots are grown in rotten cow shit. Some of them don't even know what an apple or a carrot is because they don't come out of a brightly coloured box. Perhaps increasing numbers of incidents like this will snap people out of this corporate media-induced stupor - but don't hold your breath.


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PostPosted: 12/08/11 2:59 am • # 24 
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That she doesn't hold a grudge says far more about Ms. Bell than it does about those "voluntary" firefighters.


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PostPosted: 12/08/11 3:41 am • # 25 
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It took me a while to research how such cases would be handled in socialist communist Germany since I really had no clue and never ever heard of house fires where the firemen just stood around nor about subscriptions and such.
Turns out that all housefires are handled by professional and/or volunteer firemen, and there are no "subscription based" services. The taxpayer pays for equipment. They send you a bill though if you torched your own house.


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