I need to decide if I'm saddened beyond measure or rabidly angry ~ ~ Sooz

Ebay removes auctions for ‘Holocaust memorabilia’
By Agence France-Presse
Sunday, November 3, 2013 9:46 EST

EBay has apologised and removed from its listings about 30 items of Holocaust memorabilia after a British newspaper reported that items including a striped concentration camp uniform were on sale.

The uniform, thought to have been worn by a Polish baker who died in the Auschwitz death camp, had an asking price of £11,200 ($18,000; 13,000 euros), the Mail on Sunday reported.

Yellow Star of David armbands, which Jewish people were forced to wear in some Nazi-occupied areas, were also on sale over the past week, it said.

EBay apologised on Sunday and said the listings were being removed, while it would donate £25,000 to an “appropriate charity”.

“We don’t allow listings of this nature, and dedicate thousands of staff to policing our site and use the latest technology to detect items that shouldn’t be for sale,” eBay, which is the world’s biggest online marketplace, said in a statement.

“We very much regret that we didn’t live up to our own standards.”

It said it did not know for how long the memorabilia had been on sale.

The apparent concentration camp uniform was being sold in a US dollar listing by a Ukrainian man, Victor Kempf, living in Canada, the Mail reported.

It was linked by a serial number stitched on its breast to a Polish Holocaust victim born in 1912, the Mail reported.

Kempf said he was a historian and had bought the clothing from a US dealer.

“I understand why people may think profiting is wrong but I sell these items to document (them) and to fund my book projects,” he told the newspaper.

“If I was a descendant of a victim, I would want to see how my relatives lived. I would want to buy these items to remember them.

“I don’t want people to think I’m just doing it for the money.”

Other listings on the site included toothbrushes said to be from Auschwitz and a pair of shoes belonging to a death camp victim, advertised at £940, the Mail said.

The Nazis’ genocidal “Final Solution” claimed the lives of six million of pre-war Europe’s 11 million Jews.

They also killed large numbers of Roma, gay people, and other groups persecuted by Adolf Hitler’s regime.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/11/03/ebay-removes-auctions-for-holocaust-memorabilia/

In my opinion, Nazi and Concentration Camp items should be donated to Holocaust museums.

eBay was correct in disallowing them to be sold. The only people interested in purchasing such items are NeoNazis and Jew haters.

But it's ok to displace Palestinians and then kill them if they object.

Did I miss the mention of Palestinians and Israelis in the op?

Sooz

grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr oskar, what the hell does selling holocaust items have to do with Palestinians? Can you feel no sadness at the slaughter of 6 million Jews and 5 1/2 million others by the Nazis? "The Jews" does not mean Israel unless you are an ignorant bigot. I have gotten used to you turning anything concerning the Middle east area into an anti Israel thing but this has gone even farther and shows a nasty nasty side. I gave you credit for being a better person than this ........ but I have been wrong before.

Response to SciFi and his double standards.

"The Jews" does not mean Israel

Exactly so, but the majority of pro-Israelis claim it is the same thing. It's part of a very seccessful propaganda effort.

I agree with taking those listings down, because of the chance that a victim or a victim's descendant might encounter something disturbing. But i also agree that these artifacts need to be valued and protected and discussed, so that the events never be forgotten. I also disagree that the only people interested in them would be jew haters. I think the nazi history is and should be relevant to everyone, because it was a terrible event that happened and was not an abboration. it was a direct result of the way people define other, and continue to define other. It doesn't matter, because it's not happening to me or mine.

Nor do i think the holocaust excuses the way the palestinians are currently being treated now. being a victim does not give victims or their descendants a get out of victimizing others free card. but the palestinians were not the subject of this thread.

I assumed you knew better ....... my bad. I question the accuracy of that statement. I am pro Israel and know "Jews" does not mean Israel. Sooz is Jewish but is not an Israeli. I have found maybe a handful of people who consider them the same, and they are bigots. I have Israeli friends who do not consider them the same. There are some Jews who do not even support Israel. Your hatred of Israel is causing you to make foolish statements, imo. Since you see an op about Jews in the Holocaust and only think Palestinians; and respond to my post with another slam at not just Israel but pro Israel people, then I think we have reached the point where my respect for you is zero. I know that doesn't break your heart, but it does disappoint me.

Ask Netanyahu.
Is Israel not proclaimed as the "Jewish State"?

In its Basic Laws Israel defines itself as a Jewish and Democratic State; it is the world's only Jewish-majority state.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

Israel can define herself however the residents choose ~ but, for me personally, there is an enormous difference between religion and nationality ~ again for me personally, I do NOT support much of what the Israeli right-wing is doing ~ then again, I do NOT support much of what my own home country's right-wing is doing ~

Sooz

Ha. Yes it is A Jewish State as they define it. Israel is A Jewish State. It is the only Jewish State existing. Does that mean Jews = Israel? Of course not. Most Jews do not live in Israel. And not just Jews live in Israel. You are on dangerous territory here. You seem to be saying that Jews do equal Israel. You obviously hate Israel. Any simple logics class would say if A=B and B=C then A=C. You hate Jews?

The fact is, oskar, you are simply making things worse in my mind. No comment about the Holocaust or the things being sold, the slaughter of innocents by the Nazis or anything else about the op. All you can act on when someone says Jews is your hatred of Israel. How narrow and how very sad.

I don't hate anybody.
You certainly appear to have a wee bit of angst, though.

Ha, not angst

I do hate bigots, though

jimwilliam, the discussion was about things worn by Jews in the camps, not Israel. For oskar, to bring up the Palestinians in that context he was, as he did later, equating Jews with Israel. He does hate Israel as he has shown in many other threads. His hatred of Israel is greater than his compassion for the survivors and how they would feel about these things being sold. No, not everyone who criticizes Israel hates Jews. His forcing of Israel into this thread makes me now question whether he hates Jews or not.

Although it does not belong in this thread, let me say this. First, I do not support everything Israel does. I do support their right to exist and to defend themselves. As for the Palestinians, it seems that Israel is the only country expected to help them. Other countries who have kicked them out and killed them are never asked to. The Palestinians need help, but they need it from all in the area and they don't need it from groups that have sworn to destroy Israel.

Are you turning into a control freak?
Deciding what I think?
Making false assumptions (that I "hate" Israel)?
There's a certain resemblance to O'Reilly here, IMO.

Ha, nope just reading your posts. I would say, and do say, that a person who constantly bashes Israel, even in threads that have nothing to do with Israel, hates Israel. My perception and my opinion.

Exactly what is it you think I am trying to control?

I assume you post what you want and that you post what you think. From those posts I form an opinion and post what I think. You keep posting things that make me even more certain.

I agree with Grumpy. This discussion is not about Israel, or the Palestinians. It's about the slaughter of 6 million Jews who died before the State of Israel even existed.

This discussion is about people making money off of the suffering of millions of people. This is why I think it is wrong for the items to be sold. But as I said, they should be donated to museums, where everyone (including future generations) can see and know about them. Such items belong to humanity, and not in the hands of private collectors.

Ok, but what if it was the property of a holocaust survivor? Should they be able to sell it? What about their descendants? should they be able to sell it, since they inherited it?

If they do, then would the people who bought it then be able to sell it?

I don't think the issues are that simple. I agree if it was a stolen article from a holocaust victim, it should not be sold, for the same reason the son of sam laws are in place. People should not be able to profit from crime.

But if it was the concentration camp uniform belonging to a survivor, perhaps the uniform he escaped in, should he not then be able to do what he likes with it? he or she probably lost a great deal--should they or their descendants not be able to sell it for profit? (albeit the fact that there is a market for it is a creepy fact)

So what should be "permitted in the hands of private collectors" and what should not? and who decides?

That's a good question oskar. I've been thinking about that too and cannot come up with any definite answer. I'm sure there are many "collections" of which we know nothing. All sorts of things that might be offensive to others.

How many "stolen" items are in public state collections?

How much fine art hangs in museums or private collections that was stolen from wealthy jewish families during the second world war? Is it ok because it is art, and doesn't remind us directly the people who it was stolen from?

How much of morality boils down to asthetics?

There are plenty of stolen/illegal collections ~ elephant tusk ivory is one example ~ for me, the op is a question of morality, not legality ~ I agree with SciFi that items of historical value [especially withOUT the ability to ascertain "ownership"), should be in a museum ~

Sooz