I see no comparison to Snowden and Ellsberg and North. Correct me if I'm wrong, but here is how I see the three;

- Ellesberg uncovered evidence that the government knew the Vietnam War could not be won and yet was continuing to fight it and it would cost more American lives that they admittted.

- North was involved in in efforts that circumvented Congress to fund the Contras.

- Snowden disclosed information on government surveillance of Americans.

North should be sitting in jail as far as I'm concerned. His actions were nothing like the other two.

Ellsberg was trying to stop a war. As he said, "There was no question in my mind that my government was involved in an unjust war that was going to continue and get larger. Thousands of young men were dying each year."

One can argue whether a war is justified or not, but men were dying daily in Vietnam.

That hardly compares to the information Snowden leaked.

That hardly compares to the information Snowden leaked.

Never said it did.

He's a criminal. He had an avenue to take and chose not too. Had he done so, he would be declared a whistleblower and a hero. That's not the case. He is holed up in Russia and the only countries he is welcome in are the ones that will take away all of his liberties at their discretion. There are plenty of tea party folks he could have gone to such as rand paul. We aren't sure what all of the information he stole and who he is giving it too. imo, he is the worst traitor of my lifetime.

If we ever get him back on US soil, I hope they lock him up and throw the key away.

Snowden disclosed information on government surveillance of Americans.

I might have agreed he was nothing more than a whistleblower if that was all he had done. However, he also released sensitive information on American government actions outside the U.S. The latter is what elevates him to the level of traitor.

Agreed!!!!

From being unable to provide evidence on "endangering lives" it becomes "releasing sensitive information".
The only"sensitive information" released that I'm aware of has caused only the supreme embarrassment of the US and now of Canada.

Here you go Oskar. Sorry they don't give names and addresses of particular agents:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/wor ... 08609.html

http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2013/06/2 ... cial-says/

Asking spy agencies about spying is like asking Harper about the Senate scandal.

either that, or the Obama admin would have gone after him, like it has other whistleblowers.

i really hate this aspect of Obama, actually. his sense of federal power is way more on the federal side than the civilian side. this admin has been VERY unfriendly to people like Snowden.

nobody has said that he is not a criminal. the question really is "is hiding illegalities done by our own government illegal"? our system, the way it is set up now, says NO. that seems way more wrong to me than anything Snowden did.

I selected "Hero" only because governments need to be reminded that they serve US - not rule us. If that takes embarrassing them, so be it.

I think most of us agree with you, Sid, but think he overstepped the bounds.

i hear the overstepping argument. you are claiming that he is putting lives at risk. i got that.

has this actually cost any lives yet, or is that just something that people like to say?

I doubt that we could ever find out. Interesting parallel, though, is Richard Armitage casually outing Valerie Plame on the instructions of Cheney and/or Rove. Nothing ever happened to him or them.

Good catch, jim!

Sooz

Ah, but they are among the priviliged who have the means/power to fight back.
Snowden doesn't have those means/power and gets vilified for what has been proven to be nothing more than embarrassment to the administration.
I have yet to see any evidence that anything or anyone has been put in any danger whatsoever.

We need to keep tabs on what the government does. We need to protect our liberties and make sure the government follows the law. You don't think the government would break the law if it thinks it could get away with it? Of course it would. Another scandal, now involving Governor Chris Christie's office, is proof of that.

I am torn on these issues. We generally have no problem with the government breaking laws (ours or other's) when it concerns "enemies" in another country.
Most of us understand that working outside the laws to protect us is sometimes necessary. We've had a number of domestic terrorists. That's where I waiver. I don't feel that I've lost any liberties.

I did find this quote which is appropriate:

He shall mark our goings, question whence we came, / Set his guards about us, as in Freedom's name. / He shall peep and mutter, and night shall bring / Watchers 'neath our window, lest we mock the King. -Rudyard Kipling, author, Nobel laureate (1865-1936)

And then there is this:

Edward Snowden has been asked to testify before a European Parliament committee that is investigating U.S. spying on European governments.

The committee voted 36-2 to ask Snowden to testify via video link from Moscow, where he has been granted temporary asylum, the Associated Press and The Guardian report.

Snowden, a former CIA computer specialist, leaked to the press a massive cache of government documents detailing the surveillance reach of the National Security Agency.

http://blog.al.com/wire/2014/01/snowden ... er_default


Like Europe doesn't do the same damn thing. That's what gets me. This is an international "scandal" that should turn the eyes of the world on their own governments and what they are doing. Instead, they are finger pointing while having fingers crossed behind their backs, lest they have their own whistleblowers lurking in the shadows. Deflection is only successful for so long.