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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/07/22 7:48 am • # 26 
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I saw a producer or director tweet that he would not do business in any state that outlaws abortion. He said he wouldn't ask any of his staff members to travel to a place where an ectopic pregnancy would probably mean death. I'm paraphrasing here. What should happen is all major businesses should refuse to open a shop, store or factory (even subsidiary like car parts) in any state that outlaws abortion. When you hit these ignorant politicians in the pocket book, they do tend to think twice.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/07/22 10:22 am • # 27 
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roseanne wrote:
I saw a producer or director tweet that he would not do business in any state that outlaws abortion. He said he wouldn't ask any of his staff members to travel to a place where an ectopic pregnancy would probably mean death. I'm paraphrasing here. What should happen is all major businesses should refuse to open a shop, store or factory (even subsidiary like car parts) in any state that outlaws abortion. When you hit these ignorant politicians in the pocket book, they do tend to think twice.


Their supporters tend to not care.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/07/22 12:33 pm • # 28 
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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/07/22 12:51 pm • # 29 
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Quote:
Jeff Tiedrich @itsJeffTiedrich

former slave states are now current forced-birth states, proving we've learned absolutely fucking nothing in the last 160 years


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/08/22 4:54 am • # 30 
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Ephesians 5:22-33 I think not!

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“Nobody likes abortion, even when safe and legal. It’s not what any woman would choose for a happy time on Saturday night. But nobody likes women bleeding to death on the bathroom floor from illegal abortions either. What to do?

Perhaps a different way of approaching the question would be to ask: What kind of country do you want to live in? One in which every individual is free to make decisions concerning his or her health and body, or one in which half the population is free and the other half is enslaved? Women who cannot make their own decisions about whether or not to have babies are enslaved because the state claims ownership of their bodies and the right to dictate the use to which their bodies must be put. The only similar circumstance for men is conscription into an army. In both cases there is risk to the individual’s life, but an army conscript is at least provided with food, clothing, and lodging. Even criminals in prisons have a right to those things. If the state is mandating enforced childbirth, why should it not pay for prenatal care, for the birth itself, for postnatal care, and – for babies who are not sold off to richer families – for the cost of bringing up the child? And if the state is very fond of babies, why not honour the women who have the most babies by respecting them and lifting them out of poverty? If women are providing a needed service to the state – albeit against their wills – surely they should be paid for their labour. If the goal is more babies, I am sure many women would oblige if properly recompensed. Otherwise, they are inclined to follow the natural law: placental mammals will abort in the face of resource scarcity. But I doubt that the state is willing to go so far as to provide the needed resources. Instead, it just wants to reinforce the usual cheap trick: force women to have babies, and then make them pay. And pay. And pay. As I said, slavery. If one chooses to have a baby, that is of course a different matter. The baby is a gift, given by life itself. But to be a gift a thing must be freely given and freely received. A gift can also be rejected. A gift that cannot be rejected is not a gift, but a symptom of tyranny.

We say that women “give birth”. And mothers who have chosen to be mothers do give birth, and feel it as a gift. But if they have not chosen, birth is not a gift they give; it is an extortion from them against their wills.

No one is forcing women to have abortions. No one either should force them to undergo childbirth. Enforce childbirth if you wish but at least call that enforcing by what it is. It is slavery: the claim to own and control another’s body, and to profit by that claim.

• This is an edited extract from Burning Questions by Margaret Atwood, published by Chatto & Windus.”

Cited: the Guardian


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PostPosted: 05/08/22 8:57 am • # 31 
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oskar576 wrote:
roseanne wrote:
I saw a producer or director tweet that he would not do business in any state that outlaws abortion. He said he wouldn't ask any of his staff members to travel to a place where an ectopic pregnancy would probably mean death. I'm paraphrasing here. What should happen is all major businesses should refuse to open a shop, store or factory (even subsidiary like car parts) in any state that outlaws abortion. When you hit these ignorant politicians in the pocket book, they do tend to think twice.


Their supporters tend to not care.



Yes, because they see the woman as the means their god uses to create life. It doesn't matter if the woman was raped, god was creating life so we shouldn't interfere. Nor does it matter if doctors fear for the woman's life.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/08/22 9:19 am • # 32 
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Yes, because they see the woman as the means their god uses to create life. It doesn't matter if the woman was raped, god was creating life so we shouldn't interfere. Nor does it matter if doctors fear for the woman's life.


You got it. But don't forget the sex slave part.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/08/22 2:36 pm • # 33 
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Anyone really believe the US isn't royally effed?

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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/08/22 5:40 pm • # 34 
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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/08/22 5:43 pm • # 35 
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oskar576 wrote:
Are these states in a competition for "stupidest state"?

There are a number of states vying for that title

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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/09/22 11:05 am • # 36 
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Besides the Supremes struck down a law keeping protesters away from abortion clinics so why should the Justices be treated any differently?


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/10/22 11:02 am • # 37 
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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/10/22 11:59 am • # 38 
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Opinion On Roe, Alito cites a judge who treated women as witches and property
By Jill Elaine Hasday
Yesterday at 5:00 p.m. EDT

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Sir Matthew Hale (Getty Images/iStockphoto)

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Jill Elaine Hasday is a distinguished McKnight university professor and the centennial professor of law at the University of Minnesota Law School. She is the author of “Intimate Lies and the Law.”

In his recently leaked draft majority opinion overturning Roe v. Wade, Supreme Court Justice Samuel A. Alito Jr. presents what he sees as his most convincing arguments for permitting legislatures to ban abortion. So what is the best Alito can do? One of his prominent strategies is to repeatedly quote and discuss someone he describes as a “great” and “eminent” legal authority, Sir Matthew Hale.

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Most Americans have probably never heard of Hale, an English judge and lawyer who lived from 1609 to 1676. Hale was on the bench so long ago that his judgeship included presiding over a witchcraft trial where he sentenced two “witches” to death.

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Nonetheless, we are still living in the world that Hale helped create. And as that witchcraft trial suggests, Hale’s influence has not been a “great” development if you believe women have equal humanity with men.

Hale is best known for his “History of the Pleas of the Crown,” a treatise published posthumously in 1736 that became wildly popular with judges and lawyers in England and America. In my years studying women’s legal history, I have read hundreds of American judicial opinions quoting Hale’s treatise.

Hale was not writing for women, who were excluded from the legal profession and judiciary. But he had much to say about women. For example, his pronouncements on rape were bedrocks of American law for generations, and their influence persists.

This article was featured in the Opinions A.M. newsletter. Sign up here for a digest of opinions in your inbox six days a week.

Hale believed that authorities should distrust women who reported having been raped. In his mind, rape was “an accusation easily to be made and hard to be proved, and harder to be defended by the party accused, tho never so innocent.” Judges and lawyers endlessly quoted Hale’s canard well into the second half of the 20th century. Echoes of Hale’s suspicion of women still reverberate in American law and culture, helping rapists avoid punishment.

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Hale also wrote what became the most frequently cited defense of the marital rape exemption, the doctrine that shielded a husband from prosecution if he raped his wife. Hale explained that a woman’s agreement to marry meant that she had placed her body under her husband’s permanent dominion. In Hale’s words: “The husband cannot be guilty of a rape committed by himself upon his lawful wife, for by their mutual matrimonial consent and contract the wife hath given up herself in this kind unto her husband, which she cannot retract.”

Courts and legislatures found Hale’s explanation compelling and repeated it for centuries. Until the 1970s, no state would prosecute a husband for raping his wife — no matter the brutality, no matter the evidence.

Why did powerful men find Hale’s rationale for protecting a husband’s sexual prerogatives so convincing? One reason is that Hale’s words fit smoothly into a legal system that gave husbands control over their wives in virtually every context. That regime remained entrenched for most of American history, and important aspects persisted even after sex-based disenfranchisement became unconstitutional in 1920.

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It might be tempting to suppose that modern America has wholly repudiated marital rape exemptions. But at least 21 states still treat marital rape more leniently than rape outside of marriage by criminalizing a narrower range of conduct, establishing lesser penalties or creating special obstacles to prosecution.

With this in mind, let’s return to Alito. He discusses Hale so often because he is desperate to establish that the early American legal system was opposed to abortion. He thinks this characterization of the past gives overturning Roe a veneer of legitimacy.

There are at least two problems with Alito’s reliance on history. First, Alito has misrepresented the actual historical record. As abundant historical research establishes, the common law that governed America in its first decades and beyond did not regulate abortion before “quickening” — the moment when a pregnant woman first detects fetal movement, which can happen as late as 25 weeks into pregnancy.

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Alito reports that Hale “described abortion of a quick child who died in the womb as a ‘great crime’ ” while glossing over the key part of that passage. Hale wrote that abortion was a crime “if a woman be quick or great with child.” Note the “if.”

Second, Alito relies on sources such as Hale without acknowledging their entanglement with legalized male supremacy. The men who cited Hale as they constructed the early American legal order refused to give women the right to vote or to otherwise enjoy full citizenship. Relying on that history of injustice as a reason to deny modern women control over their own lives is a terrible argument but apparently the best Alito can do.

Hale was a man who believed women could be witches, assumed women were liars and thought husbands owned their wives’ bodies. It is long past time to leave that misogyny behind.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... isogynist/


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/11/22 7:26 am • # 39 
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“If you were to take or destroy the eggs of a sea turtle — now I said, the eggs…. The criminal penalties are severe: up to a $100,000 fine and a year in prison. Now, why do we have laws in place to protect the eggs of a sea turtle, or the eggs of eagles? Because, when you destroy an egg, you’re killing a pre-born baby sea turtle or a pre-born baby eagle. Yet when it comes to a pre-born human baby rather than a sea turtle, that baby will be stripped of all protections in all 50 states…. Is that the America the left wants?”
- Sen. Steve Daines of Montana

IF WE COULD LAY EGGS OUTSIDE OUR BODY, WE WOULDN’T BE HAVING THIS CONVERSATION YOU PIECE OF SHIT - Kate Harding


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/11/22 8:14 am • # 40 
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Chickens? Ducks? Quail? Caviar?


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/13/22 4:10 am • # 41 
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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 05/16/22 4:40 am • # 42 
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Legislature, Hochul rush to pass abortion protections before Supreme Court acts
By Michael Gormley

ALBANY — Gov. Kathy Hocul and the State Senate and Assembly spent much of last week crafting and building support for a constitutional amendment and more than a dozen bills to further strengthen abortion protections in New York.

The furious effort in the legislative session's final weeks is fueled by a fear that the U.S. Supreme Court will overturn the Roe v. Wade decision that made abortion legal.

“We have to be proactive,” said Sen. Alessandra Biaggi (D-Bronx), “and not wait for enemies to be banging on the doors.” She referred to the bills introduced and amended since May 3, when a U.S. Supreme Court draft that argued for overturning Roe v. Wade was leaked.

Bills include new proposals, existing bills and ones that combined similar measures from an initial field of about 20 proposals early in the week. The final bills are expected to begin passing as early as next week. The session is scheduled to end June 2, before the U.S. Supreme Court is expected to rule on an abortion case.

A constitutional amendment to enshrine the right to abortion in New York would be harder for the Supreme Court, Congress or future state legislatures and governors to weaken or repeal. That effort has the backing of ....

https://www.newsday.com/news/region-sta ... t-s0nkzgi8


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/05/22 5:15 am • # 43 
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How Trump’s Team Conned Susan Collins Into Dooming Roe v. Wade
Trump officials privately mocked the Maine Republican in the run-up to Brett Kavanaugh’s confirmation hearing, predicting it’d be easy to get the pro-choice senator to vote for a seemingly anti-choice nominee


https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/p ... e-1357183/


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/19/22 6:56 am • # 44 
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Synagogue Sues Florida, Saying Abortion Restrictions Violate Religious Freedoms
A South Florida congregation said that under Jewish law, abortion “is required if necessary to protect the health, mental or physical well-being” of a pregnant woman.

Eliza Fawcett

Religion, particularly the influence of Christian conservatives, has been at the heart of the anti-abortion movement and the push to overturn Roe v. Wade, the 1973 ruling legalizing abortion throughout the United States.

But a lawsuit filed last week by a South Florida synagogue challenges new legislation in the state banning most abortions after 15 weeks, saying it violates the State Constitution’s right to privacy and freedom of religion. In Jewish law, the suit argues, “abortion is required if necessary to protect the health, mental or physical well-being of the woman.”

The lawsuit, filed by Congregation L’Dor Va-Dor, a progressive synagogue in Palm Beach County not affiliated with a broader denomination, may face an uphill climb in court. But it is a reminder that abortion poses religious issues beyond those of the Christian right. And it suggests ...

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/16/us/f ... daism.html


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/22/22 9:53 am • # 45 
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I'd love to see that make it to the supreme court


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/22/22 12:49 pm • # 46 
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queenoftheuniverse wrote:
I'd love to see that make it to the supreme court


Only white, male evangelicals have religious freedoms... and legislative powers.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/23/22 3:44 am • # 47 
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oskar576 wrote:
queenoftheuniverse wrote:
I'd love to see that make it to the supreme court

Only white, male evangelicals have religious freedoms... and legislative powers.

The highlighted part is the only one that counts.


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/24/22 9:11 am • # 48 
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It's official - the evangelicals who voted for Trump got what they paid for :(

U.S. Supreme Court overturns Roe v. Wade ruling in landmark decision for abortion

Sean Boynton

The U.S. Supreme Court has overturned the landmark Roe v. Wade ruling that has guaranteed the right to an abortion for more than 50 years, creating a grim new reality for women’s health in the country while granting a significant victory to religious conservatives.


In a 6-3 decision Friday, the top court upheld a Mississippi law that would ban most abortions after the 15th week, effectively abolishing the legal precedent Roe v. Wade established in 1973.

Chief Justice John Roberts sided with the court’s three liberal-leaning justices, unable to sway even one member of ...

https://globalnews.ca/news/8886802/roe- ... -abortion/


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/24/22 11:03 am • # 49 
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If Justice Roberts "sided with the court’s three liberal-leaning justices", how can it be a 6-3 decision?


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 Post subject: Re: Roe v Wade
PostPosted: 06/24/22 11:41 am • # 50 
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Trump Privately Called a Roe v. Wade Reversal ‘Bad’ for His Party

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/24/us/t ... icans.html


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